Oz Day fuss

[T1 Terry]

N/P, no matter how far you go back into history, religion has a lot to answer for, or more so the atrocities inflicted in the name of religion. Religion will never be stamped out, but it does need reigning in sometimes and only the power of the people united can do that. You can't have religious zealots in power if they don't have the people behind them .... their military muscle is still people powered and can just as easily turn the weapons against the oppressors as against the protesters ... but they have to feel they have the support to do it .....

T1 Terry

[native pepper]

I agree Terry, but it shows the vast majority of people have little intelligence when you look at all the facts. We haven't progressed at all and if you look at the state of the planet, irrelevant to our technology, we've regressed terribly. Yet people want to celebrate myth, delusions fantasy and their own idiocy and that to me is bizarre.

[Cuppa]

Cuppa - When did the aborigines get the vote?

1962 Dot. I had confused it with the 1967 referendum which saw the Aboriginals counted as people in the national census.

There is no doubt that that letter from 'an aboriginal' woman is heartbreaking & highly emotional in it's content. However the first thing I did was to look & see what site it was on. Immediately my radar suggested caution & suspicion. Next I looked for verification as to the veracity of the letter. There was none. It may be 'kosher', but it just as easily could have been written to an agenda - & Jacinta Price's agenda is well known. That is not to say that her agenda to empower aboriginal women in communities is wrong, but it is not beyond the realms of possibility for a letter like that to have been written specifically to suit her position. We'll never know, but it does sound very very similar to the descriptions she has previously made about her own childhood. What we do know is that whilst Jacinta Price speaks out as she has here, & on previous occasions is that she provides a very convenient mouthpiece for our country's right, she has positioned herself, along with her mentor Warren Mundine to ensure their snouts are in the trough.

They are both divisive & polarising figures within the black community. Something that might be expected of someone 'exposing' the dark side of black culture as she paints it. However if the rest of her politics placed her more on the side of those she claims to represent then she would be in a far more powerful position to bring about the changes she claims to be advocating for. As it is, more often than not she appears to be a woman lacking in integrity & happy to point her fingers to benefit herself. So whether she is right or wrong about the history & current state of abuse in communities (& I guess we might all hope she is wrong) her position very much suits those who wish to continue to consider aboriginals nothing more than animals.

Now if a black woman like Aunty Rosalie Kunoth-Monks spoke out about these issues (& I don't believe for a millisecond she would condone the awful behaviours the letter describes ) it would be incredibly powerful because she is a woman who's integrity has already been established. I have to ask myself however how it is that Aunty Rosalie & other strong women from the central deserts are not surrounding Jacinta Price to lend her their support.

https://www.naidoc.org.au/awards/winner ... noth-monks

[Cuppa]

Bruce your 'questions' read more like offensive & ignorant statements, which seek to justify & accuse.
It is clear that that you think you are superior & know better, but you don't & you are not. If I were unable to recognise that you are someone who deserves respect & saw only this distasteful side of you I would be little different to you in how you choose describe a race of people. Instead I remember the helpful & generous side of you.

Vilification will never sit well with me, regardless of who the group or race of people are who are being vilified.
It is beyond my understanding as to what drives some people to treat other people with such disdain & still manage to try to claim the moral high ground. We have seen it as justification in just about every conflict I can recall. Your post that I am responding to clearly illustrates the conflict continuing to this day in this country. You are far from alone in your beliefs, but that doesn't make them any less distasteful. And it doesn't make them true!

I don't appreciate your lightly veiled suggestion that because I wasn't born in Australia (& inducted into the racist narrative which pervades our national culture to this day), that I must somehow be less capable of understanding the 'truth'. It is fair to say that sometimes a new perspective is able to see with far greater clarity, & this is particularly true when faced with obstinate conservatism where change is inevitably perceived as a threat.

As someone who spent a great deal of my professional life working with traumatised people, I know that suggesting they bottle up the pain, build a bridge & get over it, keep a stiff upper lip etc never works. Working through the trauma takes a lot more courage than hiding from it, but the pain involved disipates, but pain kept under wraps is strangling. Australia needs to grow up, to come of age, but this strangling holds us all back. The sooner that everyone, including you, recognise & accept that WE all need to change, not just THEM, the sooner Australia can as a country 'come of age'. Leave it's difficult adolescence behind & become a far richer grown up society.

[Cuppa]

Was never clever enough to go to university Bruce.

The offensive bits in case you thought they weren't were your description of aboriginal peoples which totally denied any culture passed down from generation to generation which to this day remains every bit as complex as any, & more so than most. It is that denial & devaluing of a heritage & a willingness to describe them as little more than animals which is offensive.

You are simply taking offence to being told you are wrong.

[dapope]

Was never clever enough to go to university Bruce.

The offensive bits in case you thought they weren't were your description of aboriginal peoples which totally denied any culture passed down from generation to generation which to this day remains every bit as complex as any, & more so than most. It is that denial of a heritage & a willingness to describe them as little more than animals which is offensive.

You are simply taking offence to being told you are wrong.

But if you want to take your bat & ball ........ I'll understand.

I will back you on that Cuppa.
The more I work and understand about Aboriginal culture the more respect I have fir rhem abd their multiple countries. We lose so much not being curious.

[Cuppa]

I will back you on that Cuppa.
The more I work and understand about Aboriginal culture the more respect I have fir rhem abd their multiple countries. We lose so much not being curious.

Thanks Martin.
It's a tough gig when feeling alone.

[dapope]

I will back you on that Cuppa.
The more I work and understand about Aboriginal culture the more respect I have fir rhem abd their multiple countries. We lose so much not being curious.

Thanks Martin.
It's a tough gig when feeling alone.

Not our loss. I look at Country a lot differently these days. A lot more appreciation for what I see and am lucky enough to be shown

[native pepper]

I will back you on that Cuppa.
The more I work and understand about Aboriginal culture the more respect I have fir rhem abd their multiple countries. We lose so much not being curious.

Thanks Martin.
It's a tough gig when feeling alone.

You are not alone Cuppa, I read Bruces post and was about to reply when I decided to leave it until today, but it's been removed, hopefully my reply can set the record straight for those who read it.

Indigenous culture was very sophisticated, you can't be otherwise when you survive for over 50000 years with a stable population and sustainable environment. The navigated by the stars, had highways which included directions, they lived according to the seasons so moved from winter to summer residencies and nations came together to meet and party together at different times. Sure they had their conflicts, but they were nothing like today. Our modern culture has almost destroyed the country in just over 200 years and continues to do so unabated, so it's easy to see who was the most intelligent society.

It depended on where you came from as to what you wore as body covering, in the sth their wore clothes which has been recorded in descriptions and drawings of the wonderful warm clothing they had. In the nth they wore nothing because of the climate, which is a sensible thing to do. They also built sophisticated stone and timber housing, remnants of those remain in Victoria and NSW, as does their agriculture and fish farms. In Tasmania they lived in large timber and stone buildings, which after slaughtering the people the christians used for their church meetings and then held aboriginal killing hunts after the services.

There are at least two native plants indigenous women used for birth control and desert nomads reduced their body weight to below 5% so they didn't ovulate in times of hardship. Unlike modern societies, where abortion and dangerous drugs are used to control birth rates, or they throw their unwanted babies into the rubbish bins or down the toilet. Yet this sophisticated world society has massively over populated the planet, which is killing it. Indigenous people did not drown their babies, yet today we read every day of the horrendous things done to children and women by religion and the never ending domestic abuse rife throughout modern societies, that seems to be getting worse.

The most violent and abusive societies on the planet today, are religious societies, irrelevant as to their heritage. You only have to look at the state of societies and what their cultures is to see that reality, we in Aus are lucky we are the most stable of societies but that's going down the drain under the control of deranged ideologues, which includes the insipid PC crowd.

We are all biological animals and nothing more, yet we don't act like the animal kingdom which has an ethical approach to,life and only kills to survive. Unlike modern ideological humans who kill for pleasure, greed, gluttony and ideology.

Indigenous people see themselves as part of the land, not owners and abusers of it, so they cared for it and taught their children using mythical stories to show how important nature and the land was to their existence. Modern humans see the land as exploitable and they are not part of it, they think they are part of some mythical warmongering fairy that lives in the ether and have no thought whatsoever for the land or other life forms. Again it's easy to see where the real intelligence lies.

[Cuppa]

You are not alone Cuppa, I read Bruces post and was about to reply when I decided to leave it until today, but it's been removed, hopefully my reply can set the record straight for those who read it.

Indigenous culture was very sophisticated, you can't be otherwise when you survive for over 50000 years with a stable population and sustainable environment. The navigated by the stars, had highways which included directions, they lived according to the seasons so moved from winter to summer residencies and nations came together to meet and party together at different times. Sure they had their conflicts, but they were nothing like today. Our modern culture has almost destroyed the country in just over 200 years and continues to do so unabated, so it's easy to see who was the most intelligent society.

It depended on where you came from as to what you wore as body covering, in the sth their wore clothes which has been recorded in descriptions and drawings of the wonderful warm clothing they had. In the nth they wore nothing because of the climate, which is a sensible thing to do. They also built sophisticated stone and timber housing, remnants of those remain in Victoria and NSW, as does their agriculture and fish farms. In Tasmania they lived in large timber and stone buildings, which after slaughtering the people the christians used for their church meetings and then held aboriginal killing hunts after the services.

There are at least two native plants indigenous women used for birth control and desert nomads reduced their body weight to below 5% so they didn't ovulate in times of hardship. Unlike modern societies, where abortion and dangerous drugs are used to control birth rates, or they throw their unwanted babies into the rubbish bins or down the toilet. Yet this sophisticated world society has massively over populated the planet, which is killing it. Indigenous people did not drown their babies, yet today we read every day of the horrendous things done to children and women by religion and the never ending domestic abuse rife throughout modern societies, that seems to be getting worse.

The most violent and abusive societies on the planet today, are religious societies, irrelevant as to their heritage. You only have to look at the state of societies and what their cultures is to see that reality, we in Aus are lucky we are the most stable of societies but that's going down the drain under the control of deranged ideologues, which includes the insipid PC crowd.

We are all biological animals and nothing more, yet we don't act like the animal kingdom which has an ethical approach to,life and only kills to survive. Unlike modern ideological humans who kill for pleasure, greed, gluttony and ideology.

Indigenous people see themselves as part of the land, not owners and abusers of it, so they cared for it and taught their children using mythical stories to show how important nature and the land was to their existence. Modern humans see the land as exploitable and they are not part of it, they think they are part of some mythical warmongering fairy that lives in the ether and have no thought whatsoever for the land or other life forms. Again it's easy to see where the real intelligence lies.

Good on you NP.

If it were Bruce himself who chose to remove his posts then he deserves the credence due to someone who recognises their own mistakes.