Bully tactics

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Greynomad
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Bully tactics

Post by Greynomad »

Hmmmm...
China, unhappy with ScoMo asking for an investigation into the source of the Covid-19 virus, slaps impossibly high tariffs (taxes) on a range of Australian exports — but not iron ore, coz they need that.
In return, ScoMo tears up a number of Belt & Road agreements between Victoria and China.
China then gets on its high horse and threatens retaliation against our retaliation to their retaliation against ScoMo.
(If you don’t follow that, I can’t draw you a diagram. Sorry.)
They might as well have said “See what you made me do?!”
:roll:
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Ray
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Dot
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Re: Bully tactics

Post by Dot »

Just watched part one of the "Trump" years so I am so confused , this with China & Scomo is too much for me just now. :lol: :lol:
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dream4red
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Re: Bully tactics

Post by dream4red »

Yes Ray, you got it right. The big boys are all going to take their bats and balls and go home. YES
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Grandad
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Re: Bully tactics

Post by Grandad »

Just a couple of quick points of order Ray.
It wasn't a "number of B and R agreements" it was a single MOU, or memorandum of understanding.

Basically, an expression of interest with no legal standing at all. It merely indicates that Victoria was interested in hearing what was on offer and was as much to do with Victorian companies tendering on projects in the Asian Pacific area as it was Chinese companies tendering on work here in Vic.

in fact, the MOU is identical to the one the federal government signed in 2017. I wonder why that one wasn't "torn up"?

......then-Trade Minister Steve Ciobo represented Australia at China’s Belt and Road Forum in Beijing in May 2017. And several months later, the federal government signed an MOU that committed to allowing Australian companies to cooperate with Beijing on BRI-related infrastructure projects in third-party countries.

I don't really wish to get into a political debate on this. I'm just trying to provide some accurate information to counter the story coming from a well known ex Aussie, now loud-mouthed Yank that wants to start a new cold war.
That's it from me. Disagree if you wish. I know many will.

Jim

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Re: Bully tactics

Post by BruceS »

The main point out of all this is about size & power.
For some reason many think of Australia as a World Power when in fact we are nothing but a minnow in a giant ocean.
I often hear things like 'protect Australia from invasion' ..........
If China wanted Australia they could take us by using tooth picks alone!!
Really we need China much more than they need us. (well as far as trading goods goes!)
Most Aussies live in the couple of cities on the coast and could care less about agriculture or mining activities.
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T1 Terry
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Re: Bully tactics

Post by T1 Terry »

I loved Xi Jinping's statement at the climate summit, the other countries have to reduce their emissions be he would as China is still a "developing country" Yeah, right, it is a country that is trying to develop faster than any other country to become the world leader, but to consider China as being on a lower footing than Europe, The British Isles, USA or Australia would be ignoring reality.
I remember back in the 2010 region, a Business News blog doing a survey as to who thought we should get on board with China. I put in a comment that I thought there couldn't be anything more short sighted or idiotic than to make China a buyer we depended on to stay in the black. Support business at home first, might not make mega $$ quickly but in the long term we would be far better off ..... I was howled down as ignorant regarding the realities of business ........

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T1 Terry
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Re: Bully tactics

Post by T1 Terry »

BruceS wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:00 am The main point out of all this is about size & power.
For some reason many think of Australia as a World Power when in fact we are nothing but a minnow in a giant ocean.
I often hear things like 'protect Australia from invasion' ..........
If China wanted Australia they could take us by using tooth picks alone!!
Really we need China much more than they need us. (well as far as trading goods goes!)
Most Aussies live in the couple of cities on the coast and could care less about agriculture or mining activities.
Agreed, but they couldn't maintain their control for very long and the chances of getting Aussies to work as poorly paid plebs to produce export products for China would be very slim indeed. China is having enough trouble keeping it's own citizens under control, Hong Kong would slip from their grip if they attempted to expand their empire to Australia, even the threat to reclaim Taiwan is a bit of the case of getting your ambitions and capabilities confused.
The Chinese internal army is far bigger than their military that would be available to fight any war, the Chinese communist part only holds power using the same method as Putin remains at the head of Russia, kill anyone who doesn't toe the line ..... If China looses its market for selling their goods, the citizens will no longer be kept in line by the mighty $$ they would loose if they bucked the system ..... you can't fight outside your borders and inside your boarders at the same time ......

T1 Terry
A person may fail many times, they only become a failure when they blame someone else John Burrows
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Re: Bully tactics

Post by Greynomad »

BruceS wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:00 am The main point out of all this is about size & power.
...
If China wanted Australia they could take us by using tooth picks alone!!
...
Bruce,
They won’t even need toothpicks... they already own a fair amount of our critical infrastructure.
All they need to do is shut down our phone networks, water supply system, power generation, a few ports...
You get the picture. :shock:
Regards & God bless,
Ray
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Isaac Asimov, "The Last Question"

"I refuse to drink water, because of the disgusting things fish do in it"
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Greynomad
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Re: Bully tactics

Post by Greynomad »

Jim,
If you get onto the ABC NEWS app, you’ll find an article about this.
A break-out links to a further article outlining the MoU and a Framework Agreement (TWO deals) which Dan Andrews signed covering a multitude of areas where China was to be a favoured contractor. Too many to list here, but wide-ranging throughout the Victorian economy.
Andrews promised ‘trade, financial and policy agreement’ with China.
Agreed, neither is legally binding, but meetings were planned between Andrews & China’s National Development and Reform Commission Vice Chairman to finalise details. So they soon would have been binding agreements.
The article also notes that Sri Lanka lost control of its major port for 99 years through the BRI when it defaulted on repayments to China.
Quite a few Pacific Island nations have also been caught in what analysts describe as ‘debt trap’ deals with China’s BRI.
The article also mentions two other cancelled (older) deals Victoria made with Iran & Syria. I suspect they were window dressing, included so it would not look like Australia was targeting China.
Regards & God bless,
Ray
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"Insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
Isaac Asimov, "The Last Question"

"I refuse to drink water, because of the disgusting things fish do in it"
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T1 Terry
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Re: Bully tactics

Post by T1 Terry »

Greynomad wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 11:35 pm
BruceS wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:00 am The main point out of all this is about size & power.
...
If China wanted Australia they could take us by using tooth picks alone!!
...
Bruce,
They won’t even need toothpicks... they already own a fair amount of our critical infrastructure.
All they need to do is shut down our phone networks, water supply system, power generation, a few ports...
You get the picture. :shock:
If it was to become a war between Australia and China, the govt immediately seizes any enemy assets so they would no longer be Chinese owned, they would be back in Australian national ownership. Any Chinese citizens would be rounded up and put into camps so they couldn't cause any trouble and all Chinese merchant vessels in a harbour would be seized along with any planes in airports.
There would be a fair degree of warning before China moved to a war footing, they know they would loose their assets so they would sabotage them and remove their citizens and just leave the spies and saboteurs. Because they need our raw materials, I doubt they would destroy those assets, but power generation plants, gas infrastructure, steel works and water catchment would be prime targets.

T1 Terry
A person may fail many times, they only become a failure when they blame someone else John Burrows
If we have data, let’s look at data. If all we have are opinions, let’s go with mine. – Jim Barksdale, former Netscape CEO
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