It would be nice to rave good news about my rig..but...

[pelbo]

WARNING!!! The following posts have been posted after discussion advising the author of his possible liability if his facts are not truthful and cant be proved with evidence. The Forum Admin and Mods have no way of verifying this account of facts but find no reason to believe otherwise.

After almost 6 years with our first van travelling this great land full time, we decided it would be nice to buy a new van capable of more remote travel. Such as Tanami Desert, Savannah Way, to mention just a few dreams. We had only travelled as far as Albany from Townsville when this dream became possible when I received a phone call from my old company almost begging me to come back to work. My wife and I decided this what we would do.

I had discussions with Sunland Caravans who came across as the best and most honest manufacturer in Australia, by his daily use of a caravan forum. I wrote to him with my dream caravan and what we needed.

This was the start of my nightmare. Which has cost me over $20,000 to fix manufacturing errors and lack of interest in fixing the problems. Serious problems that could easily have killed my wife and I. I am writing this post to show prospective buyers all the things that can and do go wrong and how what can only be described as rogue builders get up to maximise their returns at your loss. My problems started because I trusted this builder 100%. He was like an old friend. Nothing was too much to ask for.

Our initial talks described an off road van designed for full time use in remote areas. To this end, we asked for 1000kg carrying capacity, large 12v compressor fridge freezer and lots of solar to run it all. We asked for a built in 300w pure sine wave inverter to power a totally separate independent 240v system along side of the external supplied 240v system. We needed a minimum of 300 amp/hr AGM batteries and a 40amp 240v charger and a 60 amp MPPT solar regulator, stepped down to 12v. The solar panels to be 24v to maximise current from the solar to the regulator.

We needed maximum water capacity and decent 4 burner LPG stove, plus an LPG heater.

The only problem raised by the manufacturer was that he could only give me 900kg capacity with a TARE of 2600k and ATM 3500k, my Cruiser's maximum towing capacity.

All this was in writing and I still have the original correspondence on file should anyone dispute what I just typed.

I was quoted a special price if the van could be ready by November but to be used as a display van until March 2011. This was the start of the untruths I was later to discover.

We made a few minor changes such as larger solar panels and a 6' bed. We deleted the second inverter for the microwave as being too complicated.

We saw the new van in February 2011 before heading to Germany to visit our daughter and grandkids. I posted on a caravan forum how good it looked and how good it was to have 900k carrying capacity. The manufacturer posted re this capacity on the forum and did not correct me. I have a copy of these posts. But I should have realised at the time I was fooled by the Bling! That is my first warning to prospective buyers - BEWARE the bling! It hides a multitude of sins.

We picked the van at the end of March the day we returned from Germany. Tired and jet lagged. DON'T EVER do this!!!

The staff had filled all three 125Litre water tanks - wasn't that nice....and it had no towball.....still deciding on ball or DO35 they asked...but I had already told them that the DO35 was OK...

So I couldn't tow to the weighbridge to check it. What a fool I was! I still trusted the manufacturer. I also couldn't find the compliance plate....but things got rushed and the question was ignored.....and I forgot....I was tired and wanted to get going......three times a fool now!

I signed some papers about warranty and the final payment but never got a copy. I don't remember the signing the warranty paper but I had no need to read it did I??? I trusted the manufacturer and I had already read his published warranty - 20 years on the chassis and 3 years everything else...so why read the document?

Now that's another lesson!

We then discover water pouring out of the bathroom cabinet and out the door. Call the service manager who comes and fixes it. They had forgotten the plumbing locking pins. Two months later we get the same problem. On inspection, they had forgotten the locking pins again when they 'fixed' it the first time! They had also forgotten the inserts that should be in all click joints. I fixed.

But this was some of the water leak damage - keep in mind this showed upm when the van was only 6 months old!





Towing the van out after the factory closed and went home, it was raining. The first red light and I put the brakes on and nothing happened! I locked up all four Cruiser wheels but nothing on the van. I slid through the red light. Inspection found that the brakes were never checked and adjusted, plus one magnet had fallen out!

Got to Gympie and camped. Tried the washing machine and all hell broke loose. I stopped the machine to find the bowl would not move - locked solid! They had forgotten to remove the shipping bolts. Towed back to Caboolture where the machine was removed and the shipping bolts removed. Did not use the machine again for several months, as we were house sitting. When we did, the machine jumped all over the place, damaging the woodwork. Sunland had forgotten to screw the retaining bolts back into place
Phjoto shows just one of the screws out of four not screwed back in:



This photo shows damage to the timberwork:



Before we found this out, water leaks through the 4 Seasons hatch required the ceiling to be replaced and all four windows in the bedroom had not used the correct sealant and had to be replaced. The damage to the walls has now only become visible. The LPG regulator was leaking 9kg of LPG a week. The LPG compartment was not legal, with no breather at the top to allow air in. The outlet had a rubber dongle on it to prevent dust ingress, but also stopped the leaking LPG to escape. I discovered that it was highly unlikely that the caravan was ever inspected to issue the LPG certificate. First of all I discovered that the certificate was issued 18 weeks prior to my purchase, when the Qld law states a maximum of 12 weeks. Plus the certificate says he tested a 3 burner LPG stove and mine is a 4 burner. Pluis it never mentions the other appliance installed, being a Truma LPG heater or the LPG baynet. This is the certificate (Yes I know! I should have read the document when I first got the van!) I have since paid for another inspection and true and accurate certificate.



That's enough for now. I am a slow typist. In a few days I will show how the suspension broke off the chassis and why. Plus the false TARE weight on the compliance plate and how and why the rest of the chassis failed safety regulations and what had to be done to fix it. I will also tell you what the various authorities have done or not done and who and how you handle all these problems and some advise on who to contact and chase up. And what Minister to contact when their departments get lazy.

This is the NATA report the manufacturer obtained in an effort to blame me for the suspension breaking off the chassis. AS you can read, this was not the case:

[Shirley]

Wow, terrible story & you thought you were getting just what you wanted after 6 yrs of traveling in the old van.

[pelbo]

Before heading off on stage two of our journey around Australia, we called into the manufacturer to get a few problems sorted out. The van was VERY unstable at any speed over about 80kph. This I was informed by independent experts was caused by the excess weight over the rear end. To this end, we insisted the manufacturer shift the 125 litre water tank placed at the very rear, forward almost 2 metres to the rear axles. This helped enormously. The heavy rear end was also not helped by the 54 kilo washing machine, 2 x 35 kilo spare wheels, the 20 litre hot water system and 20 litre toilet all placed at the very rear of the van. This was a total of almost 300 kilos placed at the very rear of the van - a recipe for disaster. The 220Litre compressor Vitrifrigo fridge was hopeless. It never got below -6C, ran 24/7 and needed de-frosting every 9- 10 days. Sunland exchanged it for another brand new Vitrifrigo fridge. It was worse. Sunland spoke to the importers who told him the fridge should never be used in the tropics. It was not fit for purpose. I demanded a new Waeco 215 Litre fridge replace it. Which was done. This fridge is superb. Silent and works better than any 240v fridge we ever owned.

We left Townsville to continue our journey on Highway One. Lucky for us the Savannah Way was not recommended due to bad weather. We reached Barclay Homestead. Standing inside the parked van, I heard and felt a loud bang. I thought my wife may have shifted the automatic tug out of park. She hadn't. Puzzled, I thought it may have been a HR Hitch chain link moving from a kinked position. We got to the 3 ways and found that the rear passenger side tyre was badly worn. I phoned Sunland who said it was probably out of alignment. They organised a wheel alignment in Katherine. This person inspected the van and said it was far more than a wheel alignment and refused to touch it. A second person was organised. This took a week to happen. When Neil Engineering inspected the van for the wheel alignment, he stated that the suspension had broken away from the chassis. He stated that Sunland refused to believe him and he was told to weld a few bars to the chassis and it would be repaired in Darwin. he made out a report that the chassis in his opinion was way under strength for the van:

Temporary repairs in Katherine



His bill and statement:



We arrived in Darwin to Northern Truck Alignment, who inspected the van. He said it was true - the suspension had broken away from the chassis and it needed extensive work. He also doubted the strength of the chassis. He also questioned why Sunland had sent new springs etc to replace the springs I had damaged, when in fact they were not damaged. He was supposed to replace them at my cost because Sunland stated I had damaged the springs by abusing the van.

It took a week to get Sunland to finally get the work underway under warranty. They also did an engineer's report (see above in first post). When I went to pick up the van, the repairer refused to release the van to me because Sunland refused to pay for the engineer's report. I had to pay $530 to release my van. Since I was paying for the report, I demanded a copy. I did not see the the second part of the report failing the chassis. After much argument, Sunland paid me back the $530.

Photos of the good repair job that Northern Truck Alignment did:



This bracing was required because Northern Truck Alignment told me that in his opinion the chassis was too week and thin (2.4mm) to just do a normal welding job. These braces should have been welded in place when it was built. He expressed doubts about the rest of the chassis and mentioned missing gussets and that Sunland refused him to do any more work on the van.

It was only later I found the original chassis drawing showing that the gussets were missing from the A-frame joint to the main chassis. I expressed my concerns to the manufacturer who sent me his 'engineer's report passing the chassis to VSB -1 standards. I queried how this could be so, as the report was done 15 months after the chassis was built and the van was 8,000 kilometers away so the engineer could not have seen the chassis. Apparently it was done off the chassis drawing. However, the ' report' does not contain the vital information it must have to be legitimate - it lacks the chassis VIN number. The report could have been done on any chassis drawing, not necessarily mine. However, the chassis was NOT built to the drawing specifications.

Copy of Sunland so called chassis report:



Actual drawing of my chassis by Sunland. Note the gussets that should have been added to the a-frame / main chassis rail joints. This joint appears in the photo of the poor welding joint in the DITS report above, clearly the gusset is missing or you would not be able to see the poor welding joint! Also note the truss in the drawing placed where it should be, with the spacer under the main front cross member. This truss was welded almost a foot out, with the spacer welded nowhere near the front cross member. Several engineers stated that it was probably doing more harm than good.



This is the original truss, clearly way out of line:



This is my independent engineer's report failing the original chassis and passing the work done to bring the chassis up to VSB-1 regulations:



Work done to fix. This is a truss - compare it to the toy one above the manufacturer used. Side braces were also added at 6 places along the chassis.




Now we come to the weight problem. This was serious. Originally we negotiated TARE 2600k and ATM 3500k. The compliance plate was hidden high up in the tunnel boot and could not be read. The only way I could read it was to put a camera into the boot and take a photo! It was discovered that the TARE on the compliance plate was 2840k!

Following an unusual comment from Sunland that they "Knew I was loaded overweight but did not mention it", I was very much aware they were not clairvoyant, as this comment was made in caboolture and I was in WA.

When we got back to Sydney to my daughter's place, we unloaded the van to the state it was in when we purchased it. Empty LPG bottles, water tanks empty, toilet empty, hot water system empty, van cleaned, all personal items and food removed. The only items not installed on the day we purchased the van were three towel rails that weighed 1.2k including screws. The van came to 3000k TARE! The ball weight was 60k under the plated TARE. How come???

Copy of weighbridge certificate signed by the operator the van was inspected and found to be empty (Page one shows van weight attached to car. Page two van not attached. Subtract one from other to give true ball weight:





Compliance plate:



This made the van not fit for purpose. Fill all water tanks and my capacity to carry food, clothes and personal,items such as TV, computer etc etc come to just 60 kilos.

Keep in mind that the WAECO fridge is 20 kilos lighter than the original Vitrifrigo, but the extra steel added in Darwin to properly fix the suspension back onto the chassis was approx 15 kilos.

But why was the ball weigh lighter and the van heavier???

I met a chap who successfully sued Sunland for the same problem. He told me the Caboolture weighbridge never inspects the van inside - because that is not in their charter.

The penny dropped!

I removed the two spare wheels, the washing machine and AGM battery. Made sure the van was empty as before and took it back to the weighbridge.

Bingo! We had it!



So what to do? Letters of demand re these problems (A total of 42, which I won't bore you with all of them) was ignored. I had no choice but to employ the services of a solicitor. This was very expensive. Cost $3,000 just to re-issue letters of demand and all we were met with, after a further months delay, were untruths and obscuration.
Such as the reason the van was 160k over the plated TARE was because I added a 380w inverter. I didn't, as it was always in the plans and was built in. It was also included in the final inclusions list, but Sunland ignored that fact! But it sure didn't weigh 160kg!!! Closer to 3kg!

So what to do about it all. The next step in the legal fight was going to cost $10,000. We are pensioners and that type of cost is prohibitive. RV Manufacturers are well aware of that fact.

I will continue later! What we did.

[PeterinSa]

pelbo,
Sorry to read about your experience, hope its soon finalised so you can get on with your life.

Peter

[Chuck]

Holy snappin' duck poop!!!

[pelbo]

I have lot more to add to this post, but my attention was brought to the following post on this forum:

http://caravanersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=40327

I have spent most of my spare time today writing a full report to the ABC including photos and reports, plus other information I have not included in this post. I aim to bust this entire RV industry wide open to eliminate the sharks, rogues and shonks from ever ripping off pensioners and other consumers again. The so called self regulating RV industry in Australia is a disgrace.

Have a look at this pile of failed A-frames at just one caravan repairer. Very few are more than 2 years old:

[Chuck]

Un-bloody-believable !

Good luck with the ABC link.

[norman]

The link wont work for me.....

[supersparky]

The link wont work for me.....

Or me.

[Dot]

Did for me