Solar quotes for our house

[pet-els]

Bit of info,
The Mayor of Cohuna Vic, said that they have a panel field six km long and two km wide.

PeterH

[T1 Terry]

Bit of info,
The Mayor of Cohuna Vic, said that they have a panel field six km long and two km wide.

PeterH

I wonder when they will get a battery to back it up so the town can stay powered while the rest of the state is blacked out electricity challenged Once the first town makes the move into the 21st century, it would be a smart move to back such a plan for any council official and pollie that wanted to keep their job, that would flow on to the local state and federal pollies who wanted to keep their jobs. Others will follow and the roll on effect will roll right over the politicians that are trying to block it happening so their mates keep making a $$ and putting funds into their election campaigns. Imagine that, a govt controlled by those that saw value in listening to the people and those in the big city seats desperately trying to hold on to their jobs .......

T1 Terry

[Newcastle George]

The latest:

The installer quoted Arise $650 to upgrade the inverter/meterbox cabling which Arise felt too expensive so they asked that my son, ATD Electrical, give them a call in order to give a quote. He quoted $5000 to make the complete installation fully compliant and $1200, including travel, to replace the undersize cable. That upset Arise to the point that they called me to say that the installers quote was $650, which they considered excessive, and would I be happy to pay half, to which I gave a resounding NO.

An hour later I received the following email:

"Hi,
Jason has been arranged to solve the problem.

Thank You"

Following which, Jason the original installer, advised that they would be here on Tuesday 2/12 to carry out the work, or earlier if they find it possible and that Arise had agreed to pay the $650.

During the back and forth phone calls Arise said that it was difficult to get good installers in Newcastle and asked if I new any. I pointed out that I had given an excellent review of the whole project including my satisfaction with the installer and that the non-compliance was the fault of Arise .

Below is a copy of the review:

"It Would Seem That We Made A Wise Decision To Choose Arise Solar
published 3 months ago

On 28th May, 2019, we asked our electricity provider to replace our analogue meter with a smart meter. Shortly after we discussed the installation of solar to our property with Rod Jones of Arise Solar which would include the installation on our garage roof with the inverter within same but the connection to our meter to be via the wall cavity of the house.

Following in depth discussions we agreed to proceed on 1st June however, due to the tardiness of our electricity provider, the smart meter was not installed until 12th July and we delayed installation of the solar until 17th July during which time Arise were extremely patient.

Twelve panels were installed on the eastern side with ten on the west with the installation being extremely neat and completed in one day by very pleasant and competent installers. The inverter installation was also carried out to my complete satisfaction. We did have a little difficulty getting the wifi connection to our phone but were assisted greatly by staff at the Sydney office of Growatt, manufacturers of the inverter."

Once the cabling has been replaced and the installation is compliant I shall be contacting Ausgrid regarding the high grid voltage at our premises.

George

[T1 Terry]

Once the cabling has been replaced and the installation is compliant I shall be contacting Ausgrid regarding the high grid voltage at our premises.

Good luck with that bit, they will tell you the tapping voltage at the transformer is within grid specifications, 230vac plus the allowable 10%, the problem is with the other grid tie inverters on the system pushing the voltage beyond the specifications. You can not test the transformer tapping voltage so you can't challenge that part and they have no control over the output voltages of other generators into "THEIR GRID" They would be much happier if all the grid tie solar was to be disconnected, so they hold the grid voltage high to virtually block any additional supply unless that part of the grid is loaded beyond their transformer capacity. They have no obligation to provide a path for your generations capacity back into the grid, you never took out a supply contract with them that they would then be required to honour, but you would also be required to honour that supply contract and with a big battery back up, there is no way you could. They know the loopholes, the resellers know the loopholes and the installers/suppliers know the problems, only a trip to Fair Trading will get any sort of a result if you go one the line that the supplier did not do a grid capacity test as part of the assessment of the suitability of a system being installed at your premises.

T1 Terry

[Newcastle George]

2 x 6mm cables installed in parallel between meter box and inverter today. I am not expecting a miracle but it may improve output a little. At least I was able to get Arise Solar to foot the bill.

George

[Newcastle George]

AC output still exceeding 250 volts at times which causes a cutback in output to the grid but on hot days running the aircon puts a stop to it. The most reduction I have seen is 5%. I shall be contacting Ausgrid again when we get a cloudless day re high grid voltage.

George

[supersparky]

George, you will find that in AS 4117 (guess) it states that an inverter feed in voltage must not exceed 257 volts. As most grid tie inverters do not have an inbuilt voltage regulator they rely on a rising grid voltage to input the current that the systems makes. The max voltage is clipped at 257v. The hardest part is getting your head around how these things work as it isn't quite the same as the systems that we all have and understand in our motorhomes. I have been trying to work out how to use a grid tie system in an off grid environment and it isn't that simple, probably won't work even.
Do you have elec hot water? If yes then you can get the circuits reconfigured to turn on when you want them to, not when it suits your supplier.

[Newcastle George]

David, having the HWS timing altered would not help as we currently pay only 8.5c/kWh and any change would have a negative effect. I even looked at a Power Diverter but economically it wasn't justified.

George

[T1 Terry]

David, having the HWS timing altered would not help as we currently pay only 8.5c/kWh and any change would have a negative effect. I even looked at a Power Diverter but economically it wasn't justified.

George

I think David is saying that if the grid voltage rises to the point there is no feed in, then at least you will be getting the equivalent of 8.5c/kWh for your solar because you won't have to pay the supplier for the electrical energy the solar could supply where it wasn't being moved to the grid to actually earn you money.

The fact the grid holds the voltage so high is not an accident or poor design/maintenance, it is deliberate. You are competing against the big boys in the electrical energy generation market and they will use what ever tactics they can get away with, a high grid voltage is just one of those tactics and just one of the reason for holding the grid voltage so high.
The rules are designed around under voltage supply, not over voltage, so if you start high there is a little more room to move before under voltage becomes an issue. The higher the voltage the more energy any appliance actually uses because a motor will spin faster, a light shine brighter and so on. That volts x amps = watts does not mean a higher voltage will reduce the watts, just the amps and the meter doesn't measure amps, just watts.
A bit tricky to get the head around I know, but about the easiest comparison I can make is watering down the soup, still sell the cupful for the same price, but the required ingredients per cupful is less so the cost per cupful is reduced.
A lot more to it than just the amps x volts = watts thing, but it gives you a bit of an idea about the tactics involved

T1 Terry

T1 Terry

[jon_d]

If the suppliers set the grid voltage high, then the solar feed across the city turns off sooner.

So, the suppliers sell more power and if the grid voltage was set low and the solar keeps feeding.